But if you're having this problem just take the flat of a knife blade and, holding the blade perpendicular to the magazine body, scrape a little bit of the plastic away until your bolt latch has free travel. If that's what the bolt catch is suppossed to look like then my mags are a lil out of spec when inserted into the lower. PMag Not Locking Bolt Catch : ar15 10: Top of lower receiver to top of magazine catch = 0.696, Fig. If you use PMAGS with your SCAR, READ THIS! - AR15.COM Today I had some last shot hold open issues while using 20 round P-mags. You can post now and register later. This will allow for easy removal of the magazine . Your link has been automatically embedded. The bolt catch rides up but not on the black polymer part of the mag, but the follower. This clearance is partially determined by the use of aLuth-AR .308 rifle buffer tube, spring, and weight [https://www.luth-ar.com/product/buffer-tube-spring-assembly-kit-308/]. and might have several still in the packaging. Guide to modifying .308 Gen3 P-Mags to work in DPMS G2 The bolt catch problem can be solved by drilling the plunger hole deeper but Id first like to solve the feed problem. I included a pic of the mag fully inserted, then a mag with the follower pushed down to the point of where the bolt catch stays flat. I don't and I didn't . honest. They all functioned fine. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. For me it's almost all gen 2 P mags. Not trying to be a dick, but can you summarize in one sentence what the rifle is NOT doing? The Magpul PMAG is a great, well designed magazine that many people like and use in various rifles around the world, but over the years I have discovered that they are not the best option for me personally. https://www.cdnnsports.com/catalogsearch/result/?order=relevance&dir=desc&q=Sig+bolt+catch. Also the follower rides the bolt catch up A LOT. Support - AR MAGLOCK - Fixed Magazine Lock & Release Kit Anyone else having problems with the 15/30. Depending on the rear takedown pin you are using either pull the pin (Tacticool pin) or actuate the pin to disengage the receivers (KingPin & Hyperswitch). Suggestions? The bolt catch on the AR platform is directly in the center of the mag, so the shape of the notch doesn't matter on the AR, but on the SCAR, the bolt catch is offset slightly to the left. Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more. Pmag Problem | Northeastshooters.com Forums First and foremost, I will readily acknowledge that PMAGs are a great magazine. Pmag VS Hexmag I liken this to a person who lives in an urban area with an office job, assuming that nobody needs anything more than a Toyota Camry, while overlooking the fact that some people need things such as towing capacity, off-road capability, or more seats for a larger family. Open the receivers to the maximum limit of the pin capabilities. New firearms are designed around common Colt-pattern mags, and Magpul has to keep accommodating new designs with generational changes, or new offerings altogether, like they did with the EMAG. This is one of my pistols. To my knowledge, no PMAGs will work in the FS-2000 to this day without modification. In total, I (and friends) fired about 1,200 rounds in this review, 1,000 PMC .223 55-grain, about 200 reloads (a mix of 77- and 75-grain), and 20 rounds of Tula steel case at the very end. The ones I used were my friends and I checked the bolt catch before I shot. That one issue, right there, because in the previous pics, that bolt catch isn't sticking up enough to reliably get that bolt face every time. I dont know what the limit is before you earn the edit privileges. New production Colt-pattern U.S. GI mags are four to five dollars cheaper than generation three PMAGs. I ordered 10 mags from brownells after I saw they didn't ride the bolt up. To clear, get the bolt to move back by removing the floor plate of the magazine, remove the spring and follower followed by the rounds in the magazine and the 2nd round should drop out. 1.4k It's a precaution against folks who like to cause trouble immediately after joining up. The problem apears to be that the mag follower tab does not protrude out the back of the mag far enough, the follower wants to ride more forward in the mag body, and the end of the catch tab is not lifted upwards to active the catch. The P-mags always functioned. All Rights Reserved. Here's a pic of the wear on the bolt catch caused by this: Here's the OEM mag (left) compared to the PMAG (right). 3: Magazine feed lips height = 0.446, Fig. Additionally, unsafe and unintended methods of operation of the FIREARM may also cause non-compliance. Some rifles are just finicky. This will severly damage your bolt group over time. We have heard reports these malfunctions often happened with Wolf, Tula, and Brown Bear ammo. The max difference is 0.030".The real problem is where the mag catch hole is in the lower. Correction to original post: If the solution to the feed problem involves a modification to the upper or lower, Ill test the bolt catch and take another measurement as shown in figure 6 (not figure 5). I find it interesting that in the "Bolt Catch Issues" section of the article, they mention that if the gun's bolt-catch fails to operate properly, instead of simply checking other mags, their first-line troubleshooting is to check the critical dimensions . The cause could be one of the following: Bolt catch assembly is too far away from the back of magazine well Finger on bolt catch is too short Slight slop (looseness) on magazine, or magazine faceplate The plunger and compressed spring are 0.490. Its best to identify these two common issues with your rifle, before attempting to diagnose problems with your magazines. .661 from top of receiver to top of mag catch inside magwell. Try manually locking it back a dozen or so times then checking for any wear streaks on the top of the magazine feed lips. Lastly, not only are PMAGs more expensive than the alternative, but also heavier. Close the receivers back together and re-engage the rear takedown pin. AR platform is new to me, and I hope I don't upset anyone here because I am a noob when it comes to ARs. Could use some advice, being this is a problem on MANY ARs, not just the M&P's. Magpul Pmag Bolt Hold Open Problem - YouTube 0:00 / 7:05 Magpul Pmag Bolt Hold Open Problem It's A Gun Thing 24 subscribers Subscribe 143 16K views 3 years ago Does your bolt on a. How can I make my rifle more reliable with PMags? Magpul Pmag Bolt Hold Open Problem - YouTube Excellent work with the pics and details. This is. Snipers Hide is a community of Snipers of all kinds, focusing on long range shooting, accuracy, and ballistics. They are reliable, well-constructed, and produced by a company that has a great reputation. I could not find it for a few days so I checked it. I've heard of Issues with Pmags and ARs due to Pmags having more material on the rear of the mag, creating more distance between the follower and the Bolt Catch tooth which isn't as far with USGI mags, and wondering if it is that, plus tolerance stacking being my Catch has so much wiggle room on the Standard M&P. I'll try and grab my camera. We have also seen similar malfunctions in a sandy environment using military spec ammo with a dirty, gummed up weapon. We STRONGLY encourage all users to always use the new PMAG magazine or some other 10 round magazine solution with a removable floor plate. I used a digital caliper depth gauge as shown in the picture. I deepened the hole to 0.480. The upper, lower, and jig are from Daytona Tactical d.b.a. If the solution to the feed problem involves a modification to the upper or lower, I'll test the bolt catch and take another measurement as shown in figure 5. Also, since the follower rides too high the pmags I used made a dent in the follower from the bolt. Does your caliper also have a depth gauge that can get the internal depth to the mag catch as in figure 10? It was initially 0.323 deep. PMAG Problems - Calguns.net Problem: 30 round Pmag follower doesn't catch on the front lip of the bolt catch. Also, PMAGs had trouble fitting in firearms like the British SA-80/L-85, and will not fit in the FN FS-2000 without the user modifying the weapon by removing a component that serves to seal the weapon from dirt and debris. This is not the case with PMAGs in many platforms. /r/ar15 is here for your favorite black gun links, build pics, questions and other tactical or practical information. UPDATE: After seeing these pictures, I checked my factory mag. It isnt that they are bad (in fact they feed and run very well in certain firearms) but in my years of shooting I have simply found that other products may better suit a myriad of shooters. The plunger and compressed spring are 0.490. His problem is that the front tab of the bolt catch is not engaging on the follower of the PMAG, so the bolt won't hold open on the last round. Mick 1 month later. i have thermolds, and usgi mags and the rest of them work perfectly.. Scan this QR code to download the app now. I just checked and my BM lower does the same. I sent an email toDaytona Tactical support telling that themagazine catch hole is0.049 too low compared to others I've seen drawings of and am awaiting their response. It was initially 0.323 deep. You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers. Magpul needs to tweak their mold a bit before they make the claims they do. I picked up a SCAR 16s last week and put 50 rounds through it with no problems at all (using the FN mag). Fig. :??? I think I may just shoot it a few mags and see what happens.. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Talyn said: Pmag VS Hexmag. I don't know if this is an indication of another problem being that the bolt catch is too far left. PMAG problems - Midwest PX - New Jersey Gun Forums JWardJune 15, 2020 in Building a .308AR. Thanks for this HC, I'm going to inspect my Gen 3's to see if mine have the same witness marks. The plunger hole on this 80% lower was supposed to have already been finished. The table shows the measurements of several magazines and the left or right cartridge. PMAG Problems Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated UPDATE: after tinkering with it, Ive noticed it only happens on 30 round mags. This is not the case with PMAGs in many platforms. Like you hear military folk say, Ounces equal pounds. And in the case of the PMAG, a full loadout saves the user a bit of weight. I wish I could edit the original post to correct this. Privacy Policy. Pmags have worked fine in the past. None of the 3 15/30 i have worked. Press the AR MAGLOCK magazine release button. "And here remain with your uncertainty! Some people used a 9mm bolt catch, others shaved out the bolt catch area on the mag itself. Not a back-breaking amount, mind you, but not insignificant. I dont have another LR-308 with which to compare my measurements so I dont know which dimensions are problematic. Once bolt was locked to the rear or closed, it would engage the catch and seat properly on the "bad" mag. TNVC/NGI Giveaway: 15 winners with over $7000 worth of prizes!! The BC looks the same so this is a non issue. What changed? *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win. I thought it was a nonissue with the gen 3. This solution will meet some states permanence requirements. But with firearms, there really is seldom a one size fits all option for, well, anything. The tension on the bolt catch by the BCG helps keep the bolt catch firmly engaged over the rear of the follower of the Pmag. At the moment just keep posting as usual, the edit feature will become available. You are using an out of date browser. 8: Bolt Carrier to upper receiver = 0.283. Gonna remove the anodizing, but making omelets requires the breaking of eggs; so. AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. 11: Top of lower receiver to top of magazine catch hole = 0.692. Similar occurences? Why not just ditch the PMags? Seen here is a few examples of when a PMAG has to be manually removed: a problem that isnt present most of the time with plain old aluminum magazines. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win. Not up on the 80% stuff myself but we have a thread with lots of different brand bolt catches and the dimensions that may help on that end, please add to it if you have something not listed there. That should tell you what's going on. How is it though that my. Problems I have run into in the past include, firstly, that they wont drop free in a lot of firearms. . I personally dont see why I would spend an extra five bucks for magazines that wont drop free in all my guns, may or may not be compatible with new and upcoming guns, and my next point: wont fit in all my guns. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Either the hole gets deeper, or a couple coils come off the spring, or the tail on the plunger gets shortened. I deepened the hole to 0.480. For a while you only had so long to make the edit and then never again. The follower I wouldn't think should have witness marks on it though. Mar 3, 2022. Magpul PMag issues TFB Review: Over 1,000 Rounds With The Springfield Hellion I inspected my mags after I received my order and that's when I saw the bolt catch was up and went wtf face palm*. For me I had to shave off small pieces of the mag to make the bolt catch itself latch. NEVER use this product outside the standard method of operation as it will cause the rifle to no longer be in compliance and you risk arrest. Also if you rest your gun on the mag when you shoot (by the way don't do this) it will shove most mags including FN factory ones. Personally I wouldn't shoot it until you've got this issue corrected. Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. I just don't know why my friend has witness marks on his pmags after use in my Scar 16s. Copyright © 308AR.com 2023 It knows when youre cheating..like Santa. Getting the Magpul PMAG to work with regular bolt catch /r/ar15 is here for your favorite black gun links, build pics, questions and other tactical or practical information. Morality is nothing more than expressions of people's personal taste/ Right? the bolt catch tooth begins at the center of the follower then teeters towardthe edge until it drops off. and our Sorry, I see the bolt is hitting the follower i could not see that at first.. Not sure if I understand the problem correctly, but I thought the bolt catch is SUPPOSED to ride up on the follower? Again, though, I would like to recognize that PMAGs are a quality product and Magpul is very receptive to user feedback. Paste as plain text instead, My fix was with Gen2 pmags. Continue until the upper lip is flush with the upper receiver when closed. AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types. Elite Aluminum Products although I dont know who made them. There were no ammunition-related issues during the review. Note: Firearm will not retain magazines until a replacement magazine catch solution is re-installed. Before that would be a solution - you need tocheck how much further into the upper receiver that your magazine will go. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. The problem is pretty simple, the magazine's follower is failing to raise the bolt catch. Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. Bolt Catch issues w/ Pmags + Advice Needed - AR15.COM I had that issue with a couple Lancer mags, ended up replacing that bolt catch when it broke with a Sig 716 bolt catch and now the one Lancer mag I saved that had the issue works in that rifle. As weird as this will sound, you need to measure the length of your recoil buffer, and the internal depth of your buffer tube and post it here in addition to the excellent info already provided. Try tightening the mag catch an extra turn. Have the power still to banish your defenders; till at length your ignorance, which finds not till it feels, making but reservation of yourselves, still your own foes, deliver you, as most abated captives to some nation that won you without blows!". Think it could be magazine springs? After installation of the ARMagLock the button is. For more information, please see our When the PMAG 20LR is inserted into the magazine well, some MWS rifles exhibit interference between the bolt catch and the rear of the magazine. A: Some states require the compliance solution be made permanent. I'd delete it if I could. Operation of an AR-15 without the receivers / action fully closed may result in serious injuries or death. TNVC/NGI Giveaway: 15 winners with over $7000 worth of prizes!! How do I make the install permanent for use in states such as. The edit feature will become available to you with just a few more posts on the forum. If you could post a pic of that comparison, it would be helpful. Cookie Notice You'll need to clay the upper, just like you'd do if you were checking an engine for piston-to-valve clearance. Just checked all of mine, I'm not sure how HC's ended up with a witness mark where it's at. Hexmag for 260rem and pmag for 6.5creed. the tip of the bolt catch that is supposed to be actuated by the back end of the magazine follower is missing the follower and end up not catching the bolt once the mag is empty i have a gen 3 pmag without the window and its kind of frustrating. A new one can be sent upon request. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. The Fix: 1.) : "Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.". All it takes is one out of spec cartridge that the extractor fails to grab leaving the cartridge behind in the chamber, going back then forward and pushing a fresh round against the cartridge left behind and you have the dreaded double feed where everything locks up. Special thanks to Ventura Munitions for helping us out with the cost of ammo, and a special thank you to you all for watching. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Hey, everyone. Would anyone be willing to measure and report their heights from the top of the lower to the top of a cartridge case head? His mags didn't ride the bolt catch up so we tried them out. We STRONGLY encourage all users to ONLY run premium ammunition through their firearm at all times. A friend with a lower that started at 80% also had the same problem as I do and fixed his by shifting his mag catch up 0.050". Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. The mag on the left is the metal 10 round mag, the two to the right are Pmags. When I release the bolt, the back end of the follower is sticking up, and the bolt will strip the follower right out of the top of the magazine if I let it go. PMAG feeding problem, jamming on chamber face I was curious about how other magazines behaved in the lower so I measured them to simply verify reasonable consistency. Its Alex C. with TFBTV. You cannot paste images directly. Checking mine now! Maybe after Magpul completes their move they'll address some of their mold issues, 'til then it's best to check. [ARCHIVED THREAD] - Another P-Mag bolt catch issue. So, I marked it and I'm gonna keep running it through to see if it happens anymore. It's a whole lot of details. Check all your mags, especially PMAGS, but check all mags!! Always use the firearm and AR MAGLOCK products as designed, engineered and intended for use. By Also don't buy anything from Beavercreek Armory in Hillsboro, Oregon as they screwed me over with this poorly built, out of spec rifle. The bolt catch problem can be solved by drilling the plunger hole deeper but I'd first like to solve the feed problem. Iiiiffffff I owned one of those evil black rifles , I might buy the Hexmag brand when they went on sale for $6.95 ea. Hope this helps. Very carefully and pay attention to how the bolt catch actually works, if you did you should figured it out almost immediately. When someone mentions must-have magazines for the AR platform, many shooters immediately think of Pmag Vs Hexmag. Note here that this PMAG will not insert into this civilian version of the HK-416, due to the odd body geometry. Replace the empty magazine with a new 10 round magazine and let it click into place. JavaScript is disabled. I do need to know the correct distance of the top of the mag catch to the top of the lower as in figure 10 by using a depth gauge. It was initially 0.323 deep. So, for people who only have AR-15s and only shoot AR-15s, its easy to get tunnel vision and just assume that PMAGs are the greatest, and the end-all, be-all answer for all shooters, while overlooking the needs of other people.
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